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1 ред. 04.10.2017, 21:27 — Дежурный

Тема: Rules on weapons and armaments

Besides original weapons, you can use weapons listed below in the tables.





For A-10A:

Translated from Cyrillic to Latin alphabet:
Б - B;
В - V;
Г - G;
Л - L;
П - P;
Р - R;
C - S;
У - U;
Ф - F;
Х - Kh;
Э - E;
-----------------------
Translating from Cyrillic to Latin, examples:
P-73 - R-73
PBB-AE (P-77) - R-77
P-27ЭP - R-27ER
X-25 - Kh-25
C-25Л - S-25L
X-31П - Kh-31P
ФАБ-500 - FAB-500
Б-8М1 - B-8M1
КАБ-500 - KAB-500
КМГУ - KMGU

2 ред. 07.11.2016, 05:56 — Дежурный

Re: Rules on weapons and armaments

Main idea of weapons admission on the server is permission armament from clean-install game: for Su-27 from Su-30, for Su-33 from Su-34. You can check it in mission editor with file opening:

Post's attachments

Значок Weapons for Su-27 and Su-33.zip (2.93 КБ) 

3

Re: Rules on weapons and armaments

Hello, Дежурный!

I haven't been on your server a while (around 2 months) so it's good to be back again.
But, this evening I was flying in red Su-27 at Autumn (Yesen) map, and there was also player Pasha on blue side, also in Su-27. I almost acused him for rules violation beacuse he had 8*R-77 and 2*R-73. He told me this was standard loadout for blue side, so I switched to blue side to see if this is fact and it turned out to be.


So, I have some questions:
1. How can blue side have all the aircraft from US and Russia (including Ka-50 with USMC colors), but red side doesn't?
2. Is it not enough for blue side to have F-15 with AIM-120C and AIM-120B, but they also must have Su-27 with 8*R-77? This is highly unbalanced situation in the game. I don't know the situation on other maps.

So, will you, please, make at least 3 slots with Su-27 for red side with 8*R-77 and 2*R-73 missiles to balance the game a little bit? And do the same on other maps, too.

Thank you in advance!
PappaBear

Post's attachments

Значок ScreenShot_000.jpg (375.71 КБ) 

Значок ScreenShot_001.jpg (550.92 КБ) 

Значок ScreenShot_002.jpg (444.65 КБ) 

4

Re: Rules on weapons and armaments

So, what I want to say is: make the same airplanes have the same armament on both sides.
It is ridiculous that Russian (red) planes have only 4 R-77, while Ukrainian (blue) have 8 of them.
Of course, we can use mods and change loadout, but we need this loadout in standard loadout menu.

Thanks!
PappaBear

Re: Rules on weapons and armaments

Hello, PappaBear!

Answers:
1. Only red teat have Su-33. Only this aircraft support 12 pylons: 2*R-27EM + 8*R-77 + 2*R-73. It excellent fighter by weapon quantity.
Only red team have a lot of Su-25T with various armaments.
2. Blue team have F-15, red team have Su-33.
AIM-120 is not effective as R-77. (See message 49: http://aerotero.ru/forum/viewtopic.php?id=4&p=2).

First reason of unbalansed game is different players experience.

6

Re: Rules on weapons and armaments

Thank you for your answer, but I have to say there is more to this problem.
(WARNING: very long text ahead!) ;-)

I understand your point, but let's see the facts:
1.  Red side has only 1 slot with Su-33 armed with 2*R-73, 2*R-27 and 8*R-77; blue side has at least 2 slots with Su-27 armed with 2*R-73 and 8*R-77.
2. Blue side has F-15 armed with AIM-120C which has longer range and better radar than R-77 (at least in the game) and leaves no smoke trail. F-15 can carry up to 8*AIM-120C missiles, but most common configuration is 6*AIM-120, 2*AIM-9 and 3*Fuel tanks. This plane is a long-range interceptor/fighter with best radar in game, and also has built-in ECM system. (For Russian planes you have to sacrifice two missiles if you want to have ECM.) F-15 also has advanced RWR which has no counterpart on Russian side. (Pesonally,I love Beryoza, but let's be honest - it can hardly compare to American RWR.)
3. I don't know exactly how many Su-25T is there on blue side, but I know for a fact there is at least one HIDDEN and armed for SEAD task.

So ,what do we get as a result? (This will be representation of an actual event that takes place almost every day on certain maps.)

On BLUE side there are (organised as a team) :
1. at least 1 F-15 armed with 6*AIM-120C, 2*AIM-9 and 3*Fuel.
2. at least 2 Su-27 armed with 8*R-77 and 2*R-73.
3. at least 3 additional Su-27 armed freely (most common weapons are Kh-29T, KAB-500, KAB-1500; along with R-77 and R-73).
4. at least one HIDDEN Su-25T with SEAD loadout.
5. other aircraft with CAS role (A-10, Su-25, Su-25T, Ka-50) and fighters (MiG-29S)

On RED side there are (usually not organised as a team):
1. MiG-29S (only at Gelendzhik airdrome) armed with 6*R-77, or combined with R-73 and R-60, and must load fuel tanks because of short range. More fuel = less missiles.
2. Multiple Su-27 (only at Novorossijsk airdrome) armed with combinations of R-77, R-27 and R-73, but with maximum of 4*R-77 per airplane and no ECM system (or you lose two R-73).
3. Single (1!) Su-33 armed with 8*R-77, 2*R-27 and 2*R-73, placed at airbase - and not at aircraft carrier.
4. Supporting aircraft (Su-25, Su-25T, Ka-50), most of them placed at Krimsk airdrome.

As per usual scenario, the "Team" on blue side attacks Novorossijsk and destroys all airplanes, ships and anti-aircraft vehicles. For some reason, SAM radars don't detect them or refuse to shoot at them; the same applies to Kuznetsov air-defense. Also, there are no SAM/AAA placed between hills, so enemy planes can easily hide behind hills and shoot everything from there. Is it possible that Russians don't have any shoulder-launched SAMs (such as Strela and Igla) placed around important bases and airdromes???
First the F-15 comes as AWACS and ECM, detecting the first wave of enemy fighters and destroying them from the long range. Then the squadron combined of multi-role SU-27s destroys the second wave and sinks the ships (carrier first) with Kh-25 and KAB-1500/500. At the same time, the hidden Su-25T sneaks up along the coast-line and destroys radar stations at Novorossijsk and sometimes sinks few ships if it gets the chance.
By this time, they pretty much win the war/map because other airdromes have no fghters at all, and those that spawn at Novorossijsk/Gelendzhik get destroyed even before they get out of hangar. Also, there is no new AAA/SAM spawning to defend airdromes, thus the blue team has absolute air superiority.
Then they move on to destroy airplanes based at Krimsk, and this is usually done by F-15 and AIM-120C from long distance (in a very "heroic" manner).

So, now red side can use only Su-25 and Su-25T from Krimsk to try and win the war?
Well, few times I even tried that option: I took off from Krimsk in my Su-25T and dropped all A-G weapons, leaving me with only 2*R-60 and 2*R-73 (from F6 loadout, if I remember correctly), then heading for Novorossijsk area to fight Su-27s, F-15s and Su-25T.
And sometimes I even managed to score a kill or two, but this was a desperate fight. (Oh yeah, and I was also called a cheater for winning a dogfight against Su-27 that took place in mountain region!)

So, we cannot talk about balance for these reasons:
1. Blue side has US airplanes with better equipment and weapons (F-15) along with RU airplanes which carry more weapons (as a standard loadout) than those on red side.
2. Air-defense around Novorossijsk and Gelendzhik are poorly placed and totaly unefective. Air-defense on ships is NON-EXISTENT. Hills around coast provide cover for attacks, and some sort of air-defense must be placed there! (At least AAA or Igla SAMs.)
3. The placement of Kuznetsov aircraft-carrier makes him vulnerable from all sides in first wave of attack, and not one ship provides the cover. This is highly unrealistic. (In my opinion, Kuznetsov should be placed about 20-30 km west of Anapa airdrome and have 2-3 slots of Su-33 as a cover, along with ships providing air-cover and support.)
4. Krimsk airbase has absolutely no fighters as a defense - not even on-duty pair ("para") - an this simply cannot happen in Russia or any ex-Soviet country. Even here in Croatia every active airdrome has at least one pair of planes (Mig-21BIS at the time) ready to scramble at any time. So, you really should place at least two MiG-29s at Krimsk and Anapa to attain some balance and realism.

Of course, if there is no teamwork and communication on either side (but especially on red!), all improvements and changes on map won't mean anything.
Nevertheless, if a single team wipes out complete enemy's defense in just half an hour, then there is no use in playing and we must wait until map restarts to get at least a chance to fly. This is not good for mood and motivation, hence some pilots try to compensate with cheating and other bad things.

Well, that's all for now. ;)
Please, don't be mad at me for posting such a long text - I'm only thinking about what could be done to improve the gaming experience on your server even more, as it still IS the best FC2 server that I played on. Even though you refuse to add MiG-21BIS by Beczl&Dolphin! ;)

Be well and thank you for everything!
Željko aka PappaBear

7

Re: Rules on weapons and armaments

I also translated this text to Russian and posted it here: http://aerotero.ru/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=2246#p2246
I hope you don't mind, I just wanted to hear what other players think.

Cheers!
PappaBear

Re: Rules on weapons and armaments

I will write messages in Russian forum because Russian community is more active. OK?

9

Re: Rules on weapons and armaments

Hi!
I apologize for not answering earlier, I didn't have much free time.
I thank you for reposting and introducing my text about balance between sides in the game to the Russian-speaking virtual pilots - it took me some time to translate and understand their answers, but it was nice to see how they feel about this subject.
From what I understand, some of them agree with me and others don't. This is good, because only a constructive dialogue can bring good things to us.

I just want to explain one thing: I am not against the tactics of blue team - it is prooven as efficient way of winning over the enemy. (I actualy envy them for such a good teamwork.)
I just don't like the fact they use Su-27 with laser- and TV-guided bombs instead of actual attack airplanes (and they have Su-25/25T, A-10A and Ka-50).

But, since this is all within the rules limits, we cannot complain. ;-)

Thank you again, and be well!

Željko aka PappaBear

10

Re: Rules on weapons and armaments

Hello!

Today I was flying on your server after a long time and I noticed that armaments on Su-25T cannot be changed. I was playing on red side, take-off base Krymsk, load-out Kr-500 (Su-25T No.2).
I don't know if this applies to all aircraft on the map, but it is highly restricting the gameplay.
Do I need to switch to another aircraft every time I need a different weapons?
:-(
(Anyway, I quickly disconnected because of problems with server.)

PappaBear

11

Re: Rules on weapons and armaments

If ground units of air base is not destroyed than all aircrafts can change armaments.

12

Re: Rules on weapons and armaments

Thank you for your reply!
So, maybe all ground units were indeed destroyed, but sadly I couldn't inspect that because of problems with server.
Be well!

PappaBear

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